From Stuck to Dream Job with Katherine Shu

Melissa Lawrence (00:05)

Welcome to Your Worthy Career, a podcast with me, Melissa Lawrence. I’m a career and life coach with all the corporate credit and talent development and organizational psychology. I help women like you get extraordinary results by being more you, not less. I won’t just help you have a career experience worthy of you, but I will help you build your self-worth to shift what you think is possible and take the action that will create the career you’ve always wanted, whether it’s more meaningful work you’re passionate about, making more money, getting to your next level, or being more effective as a leader. We are shattering the glass ceiling here, the one that exists for women at work and the one we put on ourselves with our doubt and inner critic. Each week, you will get practical teachings grounded in neuroscience and effective career development strategies. You’ll experience deep mindset shifts and the perfect amount of woo. So you can run your career with ease rather than your career running you. You were born for more, and I’m going to help you get there with maybe a few dance parties along the way. Your up-level begins now. Hello, and welcome to this week’s episode of the podcast.

Melissa Lawrence (01:20)

This week, I have a very special guest with me, Katherine Shu. Katherine is a quality professional, and she is a client of mine. And she is someone that came to me because she was stressed and burnt out and looking at possible certifications or job changes because she wasn’t really sure what it is that she wanted, but she knew she needed to make a change. And when we worked together, she had huge gains, not just in her personal development, but she had multiple offers, a counter offer internally, and ended up moving into a promoted role with a sign-on bonus and a huge salary increase. And so she is on the podcast today to share her story of where she started and where she is now, her advice for you. And as a fun bonus, she also is someone that transitioned into the industry from being in a pharmacy tech or working in the pharmacy. And so she is going to talk about how she made that pivot later in the episode also. So you are in for a treat. Without further ado, here is my conversation with Katherine. Hi, Katherine. I’m so happy to have you here today on the podcast.

How are you doing?

Katherine Shu (02:38)

Hi, Melissa. Thank you so much for having me. I’m doing well. Thank you.

Melissa Lawrence (02:44)

So for those listening, I’d love for you to share a little bit about who you are and what you do.

Katherine Shu (02:51)

Sure. So I’m Katherine. I’m from Houston, Texas, and I’m a QA specialist at a disruptive biotech company that is a joint venture between MD Anderson and Resilience. I have a background in biochemistry, so this is literally like my dream job. And I’m pretty early in my career and I work in quality.

Melissa Lawrence (03:13)

Yeah. And I love your tagline that you have on LinkedIn. We’ll include your LinkedIn information in the show notes of this episode. But when you say you bring the tech to biotech, I think that is so catchy. It’s really good. 

Your whole bio is really good. So we worked together earlier this year, and you have such an inspiring story that I think everyone listening, regardless of the level that they’re at, is really going to have some takeaways to get from you and how you approach coaching, how you approach your own career development. And I know this is a little full circle for you because you found me through my podcast, and now to go through the process and then be a guest on the podcast must be a little odd to you. 

Katherine Shu (03:58)

It is. I’m actually sitting in my living room, and it feels like I’m watching myself in third person a little bit. It is such a surreal experience, and I’m.

Melissa Lawrence (04:07)

Like, Wow.

Katherine Shu (04:08)

We’re recording this. And so much has changed in the past months. I feel like I don’t recognize myself, and I’m also cheering for myself so far.

Melissa Lawrence (04:18)

Yeah, that’s so good. So take us back to what things were like before you found my podcast, before you reached out to me for coaching. How are you thinking and feeling about your career?

Katherine Shu (04:32)

I reached out about eight months into a new role. I started as a QA specialist after being in QC for around two years. This is eight months into a new job, and I was feeling very stagnant, burnt out. I realized it was unsustainable, all the asks that the company was asking, my manager was asking. Everything felt very overwhelming and I felt like I wasn’t actually growing my career and I wasn’t getting what I wanted from that job that I had envisioned when I started. I was feeling very indecisive and uncertain about next steps. And so when I reached out to you, I was like, I know I need a game plan. I don’t know what I want, but I know that I need a change.

Melissa Lawrence (05:22)

Yeah, I remember you had so many options you were considering. You were thinking of doing a PMP certification or just going back to school or just like there were so many things that were options. And my sense was that it was very overwhelming for you to figure out how to manage the stress and the burnout where you were and figure out if that was really a good role for you. But then also, should you just throw in the towel and make a pivot to something completely different?

Katherine Shu (05:51)

Yeah. I’m thinking about that, and I’m just getting PTSD. But I was definitely suffering from decision fatigue.

I was like, should I do something completely different? Should I leave the industry? Should I just go back to school? Should I get my PMP? I was just asking so many questions about what I wanted to do because I was so uncertain and I felt like, paralyzed by decision fatigue.

Melissa Lawrence (06:20)

Yeah. When you’re really stressed like that, you can really get even more confused because that stress just prevents you from seeing what’s possible. It makes you forget what you’re really good at or what you’re passionate about, and it just makes it harder to make decisions. So when you were at this place where you were like, Okay, I’m overwhelmed. I’m not sure what to do next. I’m burnt out at work. And then you found me listening to my podcast. What were some of the concerns you might have had or worries about coaching? Because it was your first experience. So what were some of those concerns or maybe obstacles you had to overcome to reach out?

Katherine Shu (07:02)

Honestly, I felt really scared just because I didn’t have much presence. I didn’t know anybody else who was early in their careers that reached out to a career coach. I didn’t have many historic examples, and so I took a trust fall. And I felt like my biggest concern was just coming out of my shell. I was very reserved. And also my mind was very chaotic at the time, and I was like, I need to make a change. I’m not sure who I am. And just coming out of my shell and being able to open up was a huge concern. But I’m glad I did. It’s been amazing. I’m so glad I placed my trust in you. You are incredible.

Melissa Lawrence (07:44)

It’s such a. Thank you so much. And I remember you telling me that you even had people in your life, like close people in your life that were like, What are you doing? You found this woman on the internet. You’re going to give her all of this money. Are you sure you want to do this? You, I think you had so many obstacles between… You didn’t have examples of people that worked with coaches at your level. You hadn’t worked with a coach before, so there wasn’t a way to really guarantee the results for you. Then you had people in your life that were important advisors telling you, Are you sure you want to do this? How did you overcome those obstacles and just make that decision to go for it for yourself?

Katherine Shu (08:26)

Well, I stayed true to myself, and I also did my research. I listened to so many podcast episodes. I signed up for free training. I implemented what I learned, and I realized that I was making such big strides. I was guessing out what I needed, though. I did listen to the podcast episodes that I thought I needed at the time. But when we started working on coaching, it was like real-time feedback, and I was able to accelerate that progress even faster. But while I was doing this on my own, I just developed more of a trust and trust in myself that this is the right decision, trust in you and your credentials. And I just blocked out everybody, friends and family as noise. I’m like, you know what? I’m going to blindly go into this, and I’m going to give it my all. And now they have confirmation bias. They’re like, See, we told you. I’m like, No, at the beginning.

Melissa Lawrence (09:23)

I love how they try to take credit now.

Katherine Shu (09:25)

Yeah.

Melissa Lawrence (09:26)

That’s so funny. I think that’s so important for people to really understand because I think you probably experience some of this, too. I know I have before where if you’re really unsure about something, it’s hard to take that leap. And when you get all of this outside noise of what you should be doing and everything we’ve been taught in our society all through our social conditioning, it takes doing something different and going outside of the norm to get really exceptional results like you did. And so what people do is they tend to stay the course and do what everyone else is doing, what else they have experience or exposure to, but then that just keeps them more stuck. I think it’s so good for everyone to just hear that you had obstacles in pretty much every direction that you could have listened to, and that most people listen to, and that you just decided, no, I’m going to do something for me. And you did the research that made you feel comfortable enough, but at the end of the day, like you said, it was a trust fall. You couldn’t get to 100 % certainty because you hadn’t gone through it yet.

I think that’s really inspiring for people to think of, whether it’s with coaching or with anything new that they want to try, but it’s going to take that courage.

Katherine Shu (10:51)

Honestly, that has been such an amazing effect of this whole process, developing that courage. Because I was so scared when we first started. I was even scared during the consult call. When he told me to not pursue any certifications, I was like, Are you sure? That was the right choice for sure.

Melissa Lawrence (11:15)

What would you say is the biggest change that you’ve gotten from the coaching process, both in terms of your professional change and then also your personal growth?

Katherine Shu (11:28)

Professional change, I definitely know what I want. Every move I make is intentional now, and I’m in my dream job. I’m on an amazing team. I love it. I feel very empowered in my role now. Personally, I feel like I just have so much self-confidence. I’m able to communicate. I have clarity of my values, strengths, and weaknesses, and I’m able to bring the best I have to offer to the table. Just knowing that makes me feel overwhelmed with gratitude every single day.

Melissa Lawrence (11:59)

Yeah, and you’ve really improved communication-wise, too. You are someone that has always been seen as a professional, a high achiever, and you’ve just excelled when it comes to getting comfortable with different levels of leadership and really with anyone to be able to go in and offer your ideas and do it in a way that people receive it, not just I have an idea, I want to share it, but just to help them get buy-in so that you can get your ideas used. And I think that’s something that will just take you forever. It’ll be something that you’ll have with you for the rest of your career. I know you’re in your dream job right now and you’re loving what you’re doing. And just for everyone to understand the process of that, so we created your career protocol, right? And you had a little resistance to that at first. So you were like, Yes, let’s go through this process. Once we started going through that exploration, that exploration can be a little bit overwhelming because it is different than what people are taught to do when it comes to their career trajectory and figuring out what they want, right?

Melissa Lawrence (13:04)

It’s a little more deep internal exploration. And so you were like, Wait a minute, though. What do I do? What’s my job? What’s my job? I know we spent a couple of sessions just getting you on board with the process.

Katherine Shu (13:17)

What’s the way to work at it? I’m so sorry. I think.

Melissa Lawrence (13:21)

That’s really good to just be transparent with everyone listening, because I think everyone that I’ve worked with has had a little bit of that, where it’s exciting and they’re enjoying it, but they’re not necessarily seeing how it’s coming together yet because it’s just different than someone that’s going to take your resume and say, okay, Katherine, based on your experience, this is what I think you should do. Instead, we’re getting really clear on who you are and what your zone of genius is. And then we look at how that translates to a role. And that really didn’t take all that much time. And you ultimately had multiple external offers because we did a strategy that was getting you what you wanted internally or externally. So you had multiple options. You end up getting a counter offer, a promotion, a sign-on bonus.

Katherine Shu (14:01)

Oh, my God. Right?

Melissa Lawrence (14:04)

Yeah.

Katherine Shu (14:08)

It’s crazy. The results that I achieved while working with you, I’m still shocked when I think about it because it happened so fast. All the changes with my communication style, my awareness of my values, the career process we went through, the career discovery process we went through, all of it just happened so fast. It felt like I was on the fast lane.

Melissa Lawrence (14:39)

It’s amazing what happens when you slow down because there’s that little bit of like, I want to know in one session that I think people have, I want to know right now. But there’s also that saying, and I can’t think of who says it off the top of my head, but you have to slow down to speed up. Instead of putting yourself in a path where you’re pursuing or exploring multiple options, like going back to school? Should I get a PMP certification? Should I apply to this job? Should I stay at this job? Should I apply internally to another job? All of that is taking one step in five or ten different directions, as opposed to just like, I’m going to follow a process that works and then put all of my effort into that. Then that’s where within weeks you’re seeing such huge leaps in your progress and your career satisfaction.

Katherine Shu (15:29)

Yeah, I definitely experienced a mindset shift when I realized that my overthinking was holding me back and I decided, okay, I’m just going to place my trust in this process. Melissa has gone through this process with previous clients. It has clearly worked, so I’m just going to put all my fears aside and really trust it. I was trying to accelerate my results at the very beginning, and my mind was very hyperactive. I was like, How do I get out of the situation as fast as I can? How do I discover myself faster? But these things are things that can’t be rushed. You have to give them sufficient time for them to be as impactful on your life. You have to just go through the process and trust that you’ll come out on the other side better for it.

Melissa Lawrence (16:18)

Yeah, and that’s what makes it sustainable, right? Because now these results you have, you know how to figure out what you want. You have your direction. The way that you feel about yourself and the way that you are at work is something you’ll have with you forever. I think in the beginning, it’s totally normal to have a little bit of resistance. Even when you say yes to something and say, Okay, I’m going to start coaching. In those first few sessions, which is why we coach together for a longer period of time, and it’s not just a couple of times, is because you have to build trust. In the beginning, even though you were excited to work with me, you didn’t really trust me yet because you still had all these naysayers in your head and you’re like, I don’t know, maybe I should pursue these other things. You had to give it a few sessions to really say, okay, I’m seeing things changing. This is working. Okay, I’m just going to go all in on this. And that’s I think what’s really contributed to just the amount of gains that you’ve had in such a short period of time is you’re so good, like that decision to say, I’m just going to go all in on this and shut everything else out and apply and do the work in between the sessions and apply what I’m learning and be open minded to different perspectives.

Melissa Lawrence (17:25)

That just allowed you to just, like you say, get put on the fast track when it comes to your growth.

Katherine Shu (17:32)

For sure. I think how I put through our coaching sessions, I also realized all the feedback I was getting in my brain, all the self doubt was surfacing. I can question everything that has led me to go indecisions thus far, and I can reach that next level of growth. I had so many powerful insights while working with you. But yeah, I threaded it all to that very beginning where I just committed and I was all in. That was really the pivotal moment where I achieved all these gains.

Melissa Lawrence (18:13)

Yeah. And that just gave me chills. Honestly, not to be too cheesy, but it totally did because I remembered it took me back to that session where you said, I never realized I could fight back or I could talk back. And I think that just gave me chills again. I think that just is so powerful because everyone has this negativity bias and has all of these negative things and the self-doubt whenever they’re presented with anything new. It’s why a lot of people have imposter syndrome. They doubt, Do I really belong here? And instead of just listening and saying, well, do I really belong here? And taking that on as your identity, you were like, No, I do. I can talk back. I can decide and put that fear in the passenger seat and decide to just drive forward anyway. I think that is something that you’ve continued to see results from. But just I can’t even wait to see where you are 10, 20 years from now because you have that skill now. So good.

Katherine Shu (19:10)

Yeah. Changed my life. Completely transformed me.

Melissa Lawrence (19:14)

So tell me, how is your just day to day different? We talked about the big things that are different. How is your day to day experience different because of coaching?

Katherine Shu (19:26)

Well, the people closest to me noticed the changes pretty early on. I think the biggest change day to day is that I go through life now with no self doubt. I don’t really have that inner voice saying, Can I do this? It’s more like, Okay, I need to do this, and how will I get it done? Previously, I was just like, Oh, no. I had so much anxiety about things. Now I find that it’s easier for me to advocate not only for myself, but for other people to approach things from a higher level and to escalate things to manage up. I’ve learned so many just skills from believing in myself and caring for myself differently.

Melissa Lawrence (20:11)

Yeah, that’s so great. Is there anything that you experienced in coaching or a result that you got from coaching that took you by surprise or was unexpected?

Katherine Shu (20:21)

Honestly, the tangible results, like the multiple counter offers, internal and external the salary bomb. All that was so surreal to me. I’m like, Oh, my goodness, I have achieved the next level of growth. Now I’m finally seeing everything come together. I have so many decisions to make. And when I was presenting with all these offers, I was like, I know I’m going to make the correct choice because of all the work we did in coaching. What really surprised me was that I actually ended up staying in quality. So it’s very indecisive about my career path and what I wanted to do. And it surprised me that I stayed, but I feel really passionate about it. And we did all the work, and I know that it’s the right decision. I’m very blessed to be working under a mentor who I really look up to now. I really am shocked that I didn’t obtain any certification. I really am.

Melissa Lawrence (21:27)

Yeah, that’s one of the bigger things. I have a training leader today. I’m going to talk about that a little bit. That’s a really common thing that people think they have to do is get more certifications. Or sometimes when you’re so stressed, like we talked about earlier, you start to think that the job you’re in isn’t the right job for you anymore, or the area of expertise you’re in isn’t the right area of expertise for you anymore because you’re so burnt out by it. That’s where having that career protocol is so helpful, because when you had all those different offers and you were looking for what jobs, like not only validated that you actually do really like quality, but told you what type of quality positions you should be going for and what is going to be the best fit for you. And so when you had multiple offers, then you could use that to be a really powerful decision making tool that just had it really clear, simple, black and white for you. So you didn’t have to rely on belaboring it or overthinking it or making a decision for something that wasn’t really going to feel like where you were just going after a certain title or the package.

Melissa Lawrence (22:30)

You were really looking at, okay, I negotiated, which you did also negotiated and got the best package from everyone. Then which role applies best to what to my protocol and what I want in the future. So that is so cool. You just had so many amazing results. I’m just so happy for you and where you are now. So good.

Katherine Shu (22:48)

Thank you, Elizabeth. I am so glad I had to be by my side during that interview process. I was juggling so many interviews, so many offers and being able to work on my negotiation skills was just so crucial. That’s something I still carry with me to this day even through the day to day. It’s great.

Melissa Lawrence (23:09)

How do you view career development now? Is it different than how you viewed it before?

Katherine Shu (23:16)

Oh, yeah, for sure. When we first started, I was like, should I really be investing in my career development this early on, especially with so much uncertainty? Now I look back and I would make that decision again and again, and I don’t regret it at all. I feel completely certain about my investment now. Honestly, it’s all about identifying and breaking out of your own self-imposed limits and turning outside of your comfort zone. I think that this is a decision that I would recommend to anybody and especially people who have a similar situation.

I think that the right time to start career coaching is probably yesterday. It will always be in style. You can always learn and grow. I just see it as a continual journey.

Melissa Lawrence (24:09)

I love that coaching is always in style. Put that on a T-shirt.

Katherine Shu (24:13)

That’s so good.

Melissa Lawrence (24:14)

So what would you say to someone? Because people will listen to this and they will think, okay, great for her, but that’s not possible for me. Or my circumstances are different. Maybe what I want is different, so maybe that won’t work for me. So if they’re on the fence or they just think that maybe, which is what a lot of us have fallen into is like, Oh, that’s just for them. What would you say to them?

Katherine Shu (24:40)

I would say that if your gut feeling is that you should take the plunge, then listen to your gut feeling. I think this is also advice that you gave to me as well. But in general, the first step is the hardest. I think that just committing and trusting the process and having patience, these are all skills that you can cultivate in the process. I would just say to trust your gut feeling. If your gut is telling you to make this investment in yourself and your future growth, your future self can only thank you for this. The first step is the hardest. Taking the plunge is scary, but it’s completely worth it. My advice is to just have patience and trust the process.

Melissa Lawrence (25:26)

Okay. What is one piece of advice that you wish you had earlier in your career?

Katherine Shu (25:34)

To be curious and to be bold. When we first started working with each other, I really didn’t speak up. I didn’t really ask questions. I especially didn’t approach the higher up people, and I didn’t ask for career advice or reach out about resources. And these are things I do on a daily basis now. I love expanding my knowledge and just reaching out to people. I would just say to develop courage and just go for it. It’s never too early to do that. Just do something different.

Melissa Lawrence (26:15)

I want to ask you a question about a pivot you made prior to us working together. But before I do that, is there anything else that you want to say about coaching?

Katherine Shu (26:27)

Well, this whole experience has just been so wonderful. Coaching is so special and so personal, and it’s just a privilege to work with you. And I just wanted to thank you from the bottom of my heart for the work that you do. Thank you so much. Seriously, you have transformed my life. Thank you, Melissa.

Melissa Lawrence (26:46)

Thank you. You’re going to make me cry. Okay. Thank you so much. 

Okay, let me collect myself. All right, so that was so sweet. 

So with the pivot that you made into industry, you used to work as a pharmacy technician, right? And then you moved into pharma biotech. I know that there are people that listen to this that are interested in making that transition. So can you share a little bit about how you got your foot in the door?

Katherine Shu (27:19)

Sure. At the time, I was also going through a lot of decision fatigue. I have a background in biochemistry, so I could have gone a lot of different directions with it. I could have pursued medical school, pharmacy school, optometry school, dental school, et cetera. I had so many options and opened doors. After graduating, I just did a trust fall with a recruiter who was working in the Houston area. She said that she found a job that closely aligns with my proficiencies and my interests, and I just trusted her. I learned a little bit more about the industry, about quality control, and I figured, okay, this sounds like a logical next step. I want to explore it further. I want to learn more. After getting to work in that position for a while, I realized, oh, my next interest is quality. So it’s okay to not know all the pieces of the puzzle at the exact moment that you’re making a decision. But if you have that gut feeling that things are aligned with what you’re looking for, I would just say to pursue it. I’m glad I did because I wasn’t sure what I was getting myself into, but I know that this is the industry that I’m meant to be in.

Katherine Shu (28:35)

I have a lot of intersecting interests now. I’m very interested in data science and AI, and I love quality. And I’m very fascinated by the intersection of these things, especially in a transformative sense of where that’s going to take our industry years from now.

Melissa Lawrence (28:57)

I know. You are just going to do such big things. I know it. And I just want to say, listening to you share that experience, it seems like you have the ability to trust yourself. You mentioned trust with me, like taking the trust fall into the process. And then you mentioned it again with this recruiter when you were given this opportunity for something that you hadn’t really seen yourself in before, but you trusted the person and you trusted yourself to just explore it. I think that even though you talk about being curious and how that’s really helped you, I think you’ve always had a little bit of that, because I think that allowed you to make the leap into coaching, and it allowed you to consider this role in the industry is to take this little trust leap, right? And to be curious about what that could look like. I think you have a little bit of self-trust that you can have your own back regardless of what happens. And I think that’s so important because that’s a muscle that we’ve strengthened together. But it’s a muscle that is really important for everyone to have is to know that no matter what you go after, no matter what you want, when you have the ability to trust yourself that you can handle it and that you can take care of anything that comes out as a consequence of that decision, it just makes your potential so much brighter because you’re not so afraid, because you know that whatever happens is just another problem to solve.

Melissa Lawrence (30:31)

But the other end of it, like you said, is that you get into your dream job, that you achieve more than you think is possible, and that you put yourself on a path you wouldn’t be otherwise. Yeah.

Katherine Shu (30:44)

That’s interesting to hear you say that because I didn’t realize that I had a bit of that self-trust to begin with. When we started working together, I didn’t feel like I trusted myself. Maybe I trusted myself a little miniscule amount, but now it’s so profound because I feel empowered and I feel that self-efficacy and that confidence from this process. I know who I am and I know what I bring to the table, and I know the direction I want to go and the impact I want to have. And it’s just been amazing ever since.

Melissa Lawrence (31:20)

Yeah. I think it’s the difference between self-trust and career. I think sometimes we take our career very seriously and we get very perfectionist about our career and making the right choice and being seen a certain way. And so you can personally have that self-trust of like, I’m going to explore this, or I’m going to look into this, or I’m going to invest my money into this. And that’s a level of self-trust. And then there’s a different type of self-trust, which is, I’m going to feel vulnerable in a career setting, or I’m going to make a decision where I might look wrong, or I’m going to try something new and it might not work out, or I might feel embarrassed in being okay with those emotions. I think that that’s more difficult to do in the workplace than it is to do when it’s in the comfort of your living room.

Katherine Shu (32:11)

Yeah, for sure. I completely agree with you.

Melissa Lawrence (32:15)

Okay. Well, I don’t have any other questions for you. I would love for you to share if you’re open to it where people can find you and connect with you maybe on LinkedIn. I’m sure when people listen, they’re going to want to check you out and maybe connect with you.

Katherine Shu (32:29)

Oh, wow. Yeah, of course.

Katherine Shu (32:33)

I’m on LinkedIn. Feel free to reach out. And I’m looking forward to connecting with any listeners. Thank you so much for having me on the podcast. This is so thrilling to say because I feel like this is where it all started and it’s amazing to be a part of your story as well. So thank you again.

Melissa Lawrence (32:56)

Yeah, thank you so much for coming on. So we will link to your LinkedIn. It’s Katherine Shu. We’ll link to you on the show notes for this episode. So anyone that is looking to connect can easily find you. Okay, I’ll talk to you soon. 

Melissa Lawrence (33:43)

Hey there. If you’re ready to be in a role you love, I want to invite you to join Beyond the Ceiling, where you’re going to stop feeling stuck, know your best career move, get in a role you love where you can have the impact you want to while feeling more confident and earning more with my proven process. Head over to www.yourworthycareer.com/beyond to get all of the details.